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http://geek.pikimal.com/2011/08/28/h...fs-armor-lock/
Armor lock nerf. Reticule bloom optional. 3SK beast machine coming back.
Gonna be a good update.
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http://geek.pikimal.com/2011/08/28/h...fs-armor-lock/
Armor lock nerf. Reticule bloom optional. 3SK beast machine coming back.
Gonna be a good update.
This update will make me very happy, and it shows that 343i knows what they're doing.
Fucking YES!humansArmour lock always has been, still is, and always will bestupida dumb, overpowered gimmick. Except this update changes this. classic magnum might be cool, unless it's whored. Bloom is stupid too, glad to see it gone.
Looks like i'll be going back to Reach.
The classic pistol will only be in the classic playlists, which is awesome so it won't be whored in playlists with the DMR and all that.
Never had a problem with the bloom, myself, I just sort of delt with it like everybody else who played the game was forced to. I'm neutral on the implementation of a bloom option. Though I think no bloom will even the playing field with H1 pistols.
I'm just glad they realized shipping Anniversary with nothing but MP maps was going to cause nerd rage.. I welcome this TU
Neat.Quote:
the addition of Halo: Combat Evolved’s iconic magnum to “special, classic playlists”
Fucking why didn't Bungie think of that.Quote:
a change so that the armor lock ability only absorbs damage based on your remaining energy, rather than turning you into a glowing ball of invincibility.
Would be better if it was just permanently disabled for all playlists, but still cool.Quote:
the ability to disable reticle bloom for weapons
Good, camo was annoying.Quote:
a reduction in the duration of the active camouflage armor ability
YES YES FUCKING GOD YES IT'S ABOUT TIMEQuote:
a new inability to block sword attacks with anything but another sword.
Looks like I'll be picking Reach back up. This is how the game should have been from the start.
This. Though with all of the TF2, occasional JK2, and non-gaming I've been doing lately I'm probably going to get bullshat by something completely unrelated and ragequit Reach again. %-)Quote:
Originally Posted by nuttyyayap
guess 343 knows whats up
Gonna be hilarious if they do Halo better than Bungie did. They did wind up with some of Bungie's big employees so I wouldn't be suprised
From this, I can conclude that 343 has a better idea of gameplay design than the Reach team.
D ear god yes. I can play reach again.
wait, a new INability to block sword attacks with anything but another sword? as in, that lucky as fuck situation where youd sometimes melee a sword lunge and live is gone?
No, that one where some chukcklefuck would parry your sword slash with his fist, backpedal, and shoot you in the face is gone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Donut
Seriously, the fucking thing is a one-hit kill. How does a fist magically block it?
How does a fist punch hard enough to pulverize flesh in two hits through energy shields and titanium ceramic power-armour?
It's a game. I didn't really have a problem with that ability, though. I am nimble enough to manage to always strike from the side or rear, even without surprise n my side.
I think it should be noted, because I don't think some people understand this, these new configurations they're able to do to the game variants won't be global. They'll be used in their "classic" playlist along with whatever they decide, but they're not going to be rolling this out as a global Reach change (eg, BTB won't have it). That, and they can control just how much change there is (eg, they can scale bloom all the back to it's original value for a game variant)
Indeed. Regular Slayer will likely remain the same for the most part. Though I have to wonder if the Armor Lock nerf and Sword buff will be global.
Fists are capable of more than you'd thinkQuote:
Originally Posted by p0lar_bear
Attachment 2340
The title update won't be applied to BTB?
Well if they don't come out with a big team variant for the update I guess I won't have reason to go back to Reach... :allears:
All of the changes in the TU are new megalo hooks. They can apply them to whatever spectrum of gametypes and playlists they want. Some options are backend only, like the 0-100% bloom scale. The Beta hoppers are going to be up in early October after the TU comes out (according to what has been said so far) at the end of September. There they will be testing out the changes on the current maps and introducing some of the new gametype changes.
Based on community reaction certain changes will be rolled out into various playlists. Then when CEA comes out there will be dedicated classic playlists featuring the classic gametypes and classic versions of maps alongside playlists that have the updated versions of the classic maps with new pathing, weapons, and AAs.
i never understood why people with 4gb harddrives couldn't play online co-op...
Too late.
Yeah, I've said that's how it should have been done from the beginning. It should be enough to deflect a single rocket or a close range hammer melee, but not enough to make you invulnerable from any attack for several seconds.Quote:
the armor lock ability only absorbs damage based on your remaining energy
I love all the update features apart from the bloom. How can people not time their damn shots? Spamming the trigger should not end in success. Slow and steady win the race :D
So the reason this is an issue with the TU is because if I want to play on a "well populated" playlist that has the new Pistol, Armour Lock, melee fix etc, I will have to put up with having little or no bloom. Which sucks.
Armor lock should either:Quote:
Originally Posted by jcap
- Not exist
- Only work in very short bursts (time it right and you can block a rocket or incoming vehicle, but you can't use it as a stall tactic)
- Leave you momentarily vulnerable after you exit (no holding it down for the full duration, letting your shileds recharge, and then hopping behind cover as soon as it deactivates)
- Not exist
1 or 4 are the best options, but 2 or 3 would at least be tolerable.
I'm not questioning vs. reality, I'm questioning the counter-intuitiveness of it. The sword has always been a (limited use since Halo 3) fuck-you stick that feels like it was meant to roll some heads and limbs. Distance is the only true counter to the sword; if you're within distance (which probably needs to be reduced some), pressing that button should speed you at your target doing 80 miles per hour for a satisfying kill, not a 50/50 chance to be cockteased and then shot in the face because your victim was flailing their arms around like a stereotypical gay man in a slap fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
Or how about having the sword not have melee lunge at all?
It's a one hit kill weapon as it is, the distance you can be from the enemy should be enough to serve it as it is without having the ability to fly at the speed of light at your opponent.
The Sword was fine in Halo 3, I see no reason why they decided to add in any way to block it without having another sword. After looking at the changes being made in this update, I'm starting to wonder what the hell Bungie was thinking when they made this game...
They knew what the players wanted better than they did obviously.
Between the long-range, pinpoint accuracy of the DMR and NR, the anti-vehicle sniper rifle, the broken-as-hell banshee, the awful vehicle health system, and Hemorrhage, BTB can't be salvaged,Quote:
Originally Posted by TM_updates
Permit me to disagree and appreciate the fact that I can actually kill vehicles in reach with something other than a rocket launcher.
The greater variety of weapons that can do damage to vehicles isn't the problem. That's actually great. The issue is that the spartan laser was the absolute worst aspect of BTB in Halo 3, and now the sniper rifle is basically a mini-splaser. Terrible idea.
Also, damaged vehicles are basically deathtraps, instead of the damage being mostly aesthetic. Combine that with the underpowered chaingun and useless missiles, the warthog's just a novelty vehicle in this game.
I was never big on vehicles myself, so I never noticed. I'm the profag everybody hates who sits around with sniper rifles and dmrs and picks people off from the corners of the map.
I think we should all look at the bigger picture at hand:
http://www.modacity.net/forums/image...atar922_41.gif
'da fuck?
:V
We all know it's a game, that doesn't change the fact that having your searing hot beam of light that you went to great effort to aquire blocked by someone's fist is unsatisfying and obnoxious. The fact that they can then back off and headshot you while you're virtually helpless only adds to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
We've already been over this before in other threads so let's just say bloom detracts significantly from the skill factor rather than adding to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Limited
:like:Quote:
Originally Posted by Arteen
It does. Almost every time I get into a 1v1 with someone and we are both sporting DMRs, I win because I am not firing as fast as I can. If they kill me, it's by the seat of their pants with less shots fired by me, but fired much more accurately. That, or I pull out the pistol and school them in sidearm use. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Limited
@Pooky: I know it's obnoxious, but please, tell me what isn't in Halo? Destructible vehicles are obnoxious, all the useful guns being almost treated like power weapons is onoxious, starting with DMRs is obnoxious, armour abilities are obnoxious, and the list goes on. Using the sword is as much about timing and positioning as it is about it being a power weapon; you aren't supposed to be able to just sprint around the map slaughtering people.
You forgot to add competitive gaming in general to that list
and guns. and the ability to kill people. and scores. and k/d ratio on the site.
in fact in order to make halo obnoxious free we might as well not play. otherwise it's like going to a restraunt, saying the food sucks, and then we keep going back despite the fact that the food tastes like leaky horse ass
Armor Lock is only acceptable in BTB playlists. Anywhere else makes it stupid.
Elite slayer?Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHalo003
Stick grenade spam.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
This is the dumbest counter argument I've ever heard for anything. Why would you even play Halo if you find everything obnoxious.Quote:
Originally Posted by t3h m00kz
I was being sarcastic. I deal with the shit in the game like everybody else who decides to play it. If everyone has to deal with bloom, a broken sword and an OP armor lock then it's an even playing field and I'm not getting jewed out of shit.
And you don't think the game would be more fun if we didn't have to deal with those things?
I've never had a problem with them. I pace my shots, I never touch sword, and I whore armor lock.
Funny thing: I don't play Halo [2, 3, ODST, Reach]. :v: Isn't Reach being totally obnoxious the entire reason we are complaining?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooky
That said, nothing was obnoxious in the first game. Not one thing was obnoxious. Overpowered, maybe. Obnoxious, no.
Eh, grenade spamming got on my nerves but other than that nothing really was.
e:
Well yeah but that isn't what you saidQuote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
You should try playing Xbox Connect sometime.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
http://www.modacity.net/forums/image...atar111_48.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by Kornman00
OH SH-
My b. Was implying it with the list of other obnoxious things, but I should have been specific.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooky
Wishing they would put target leading back into the sniper rifle. That would knock about half of the Reach community down a couple of pegs.
I don't know what they did to the Sniper, but it feels like it has about 60x more auto aim compared to Halo 3. I was perfectly fine with the Sniper in 3, but now it's so easy to use it's retarded. Almost on the level of the auto-aim cannon from Halo 2.
Whadda you mean? I found the Reach sniper the hardest to use.
While I agree it needs to be fixed, I've found the sniper rifles insanely hard to use since the first game. I don't know what it is. I mean, it's not the recoil; I'm having a hard time with just aiming it for that first shot. They also all sound squishy, which throws me. Audio plays a huge part in my game performance. So do weapon origins.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooky
Urgh, reach's sniper is so easy I kept getting head shots easy in the beta and retail, and after doing that a lot I tried going back to sniping in halo 3 and I got really bad thanks to Reach.Quote:
Originally Posted by nuttyyayap
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
5x zoom and less auto aim range does that. 5x as opposed to 2x gives you less of an auto aim angle when scoped, and therefore, makes it more of a bitch
I thought the sniper rife in Reach was the easiest out of all the games. I could get headshots from across the map despite completely missing players.
Really now? I mean, the feedback from the game seems like it's actively pushing my reticle off-target, but I'll take your word for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by t3h m00kz
I could only ever snipe in Halo 2. I suck with it in both Halo 3 and Reach, and never could figure it out (or bothered to) on PC.
PC took a LOT of skill. You had to know what the latency was and know how far to lead your shots relative to that latency, target direction, and speed. It wasn't easy, but once you got it into muscle memory you were nigh unstoppable.
meh the fact you had to calculate lead on snipers made me not want to ever play hce again.
wat.
That's what made it so addicting; knowing you were boss because you could do reliably what 80% of the players could not. And if you couldn't, learning how to so you could school that asshat who could was a great motivator.
Hit-scan is boring. If I want to mindlessly point and click, I'll go play Minesweeper.
They want the sniper rifles to be weapons anyone can use intuitively, but that was just not fun being on the wrong end of a SR in Reach.
I haven't played PC/CE in years, but you could juke, couldn't you? You could almost instantly go from strafing right to strafing left thanks to our friend the keyboard. With a stick, you decelerate and come to a complete stop when you try to do that.
If they took the Halo 3 SR, made it hitscan, and added in a damn hit sound so that when the sight recoils, you know what the Hell just happened and to help train people with an aural cue so that they can get better, faster. And if they gave us some evasion options that were a standard part of the game controls and not armor ability gimmicks, I would be excited to see that scenario at work.
A hitsound in halo 3? Gosh would have been too good of an idea.
Getting hits in Halo 3 wasn't the problem. The problem is all the weapons are so finicky that even getting a solid hit doesn't always help you (SHOTGUN).
That and the fact that you can get killed before your shots register, which made shotgun fights bullshit. Host advantage was ridiculous until Reach. I'm glad they were smart enough to finally add two-way kills. Seems like it wouldn't have been hard to have coded in the first place, considering games like Quake 3 had shit like that which worked perfectly
Funny, the same could be said about bloom and timing your shots!Quote:
Originally Posted by Warsaw
And Armor Lock.
Timing your usage based upon grenades and heavy weapons.
I would have mentioned armor lock too, but that's like shouting "whooooo, Obamamcare!" in a crowd full of Tea Partiers, and I didn't feel like watching a blood bath unfold.
You've inspired me to do such an act.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kornman00
Anyways, I have to bitch about vehicles for a minute.
lmao, 5 seats = killing spree in one splaser! But I agree. I also wish they would have at least put the GL Falcon variant in the Forge palette...along with civie vehicles. For Customs and machinima.
For the tank tho, I prefer the separation (since the Wraith does the same thing). Plus, it makes it easier to creep up on that bitch when there's no gunner. It's easy to dodge tank fire (since it's a slower cadence), but FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUU- when it comes to a stream of .50cal in your face.
Yeah, except timing your shots is easy, anyone can do it, and 'timing is hard' isn't why everyone hates the DMR.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kornman00
GG.
And yet people still seem to have troubles timing their shots.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooky
Everyone hates the DMR because it isn't their scalpel BR from Halo 2, the DMR was near perfect in the Beta and then the "competitive" crowd complained because it wasn't their all round use weapon.
Reach really needs a BR/carbine-like weapon as the primary spawn weapon instead of the DMR. As in, a proper medium-range weapon. BTB is often so miserable because everyone spawns with a long-range gun. I can't image how terrible a map like Standoff would be in Reach.
Leading your shots wasn't hard either, anyone can do that too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooky
Needle rifle is my preferred weapon tbh. Less recoil, faster shots. Its like an m16 to AK comparisonQuote:
Originally Posted by Arteen
But halo 1 was pretty much the same way, if you recall. Everyone spawned with a rediculous weapon. Difference being halo pc is filled with twelve year olds who have never played an fps in their lives, and therefore makes it less frustrating than a profag wankfest.
Also no autoaim and the lag made the pistol 12sk.
The difference between the Pistol and the DMR is where the Pistol has a clearly limited maximum range, the DMR does not (within the bounds of any of the official maps). Also while the Pistol requires actual aim to use at close range, with the DMR you can just spam and follow up with an auto aiming super lunging homing melee attack.Quote:
Originally Posted by t3h m00kz
I didn't say it was super hard. It's a whole lot harder than 'timing' DMR shots though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Champ
I've never complained about bloom and shot timing. That's everyone else. I don't honestly care if they retain it or get rid of it. That said, the game doesn't accurately (lol) reflect the skill required to effectively use the bloom mechanic anyways because of terrible maps and other mechanics, so it's a moot point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kornman00
As for Armour Lock...well...I don't get mad at it. I just put on this face when I get killed by it:
:|
I dont know about you guys but my life's value is determined by my skill at vidja.
Pretty sure that's just you.
porn
No no Korn, go to the Donors Lounge for that.
I forgot that part of the site even existed
and how much porn I can collect.
If I'm not furiously ejaculating while out BRing a level 50 and slapping it in my montage my life is empty and dull.
Who needs real life accomplishments anyway
I'm still confused over exactly why people are so pissed at reticle bloom; to me, reticle bloom is a cosmetic feature that gives an indication of how accurate my next shot is, but I'm reading it as the whole accuracy system which has been in place since Halo 1.
It only pisses people off in terms of the DMR. That's the funny thing. Everyone else is okay with it for almost everything else (except maybe the pistol and NR). Apparently people get butthurt over their weapons not all being pin-point (and I'm talking the Error is 0 and the Projectile Error is 0 by 0). And people wonder why I prefer an AR or Pistol over the DMR.Quote:
Originally Posted by p0lar_bear
That's exactly what it is, a cosmetic feature to visually show your cone of error. That shit has been there since the beginning :|Quote:
Originally Posted by p0lar_bear
this ^ basically. somebody said that doesnt happen in halo 1? because it does. look at the assault rifle with fully auto vs pacing your shots in small bursts. i cant say the same for halo 2 or 3, but i feel like i remember shots becoming less accurate with the plasma rifle in halo 2. i think there was a SMALL error cone for sustained fire in halo 3, but it was hardly noticeable. somebody made an auto fire controller and used it with the AR, and apparently it was more accurate, but not by much.
the counter argument iv been hearing is that on the DMR it leads to lucky spam headshots due to the randomness of the shot if you dont let the bloom settle. as far as i know, thats the complaint. its never happened to me, either by me or no me, so i cant really judge. i feel like if you just pace your shots from the getgo in a shootout, you can land your 4 shots before the other guy can spam and get a lucky headshot. the delay is what? 3/10 of a second? the way iv been playing, you should be able to get 4 accurate shots off while they get off 5 or 6 of them, with the last 4 being pretty inaccurate due to bloom.
i will say that i would enjoy this game a lot less if it became halo 3 style fire-as-fast-as-you-can-with-no-accuracy-error. that attracts the pro wannabes, and that ruins the game experience every time for me. it seems like if randomness is the issue, then the shotgun should be a huge complaint, because sometimes it kills at a certain distance, and sometimes it misses completely at that same distance or just a little bit further. the shotgun doesnt have bloom, btw.
I miss seeing the Bloom on the shotgun.
It was one of the most appropriate weapons to have Bloom on because you could see when your shot was aligned again for another shot.
Halo 1 had error acceleration, but it was primarily confined to the full auto weapons. The pistol and sniper rifle shot true, but they could only be fired at a prescribed rate, so if somebody shoots first, he's automatically ahead of the damage curve for the rest of the exchange. They didn't like that, so with Reach they allow you to fire headshot weapons at faster rates, with the trade-off being error acceleration that was not really a factor for those types of weapons in previous Halo games. You simply weren't allowed to shoot them fast enough for it to matter.
Basically they made it less 'point-and-click' and thus requires more skill. Skill about how to use a fucking tool. Just as you wouldn't rush into an actual fucking field with full-auto selected on an M4 (forget if it only has burst or FA) or whatever trying to shoot a dipshit extremist. The same thing that happens in HPC where you have to know how to adjust for lag.
Of course, I can hear someone moaning about hit-scan. They can build themselves a bridge over the river they're crying. It's a game. Network latency happens. Here's an application for the Marines if you want real-life.
If I understand the argument, it's not really about skill, it's about luck being introduced into the equation. Someone can be perfectly disciplined in their use of a DMR and lose to some yahoo who is rapidly squeezing off shots and blooming his reticle to encompass the entire screen. At that point, it becomes a dice roll whether or not those shots land. If they DO land, then the guy using "skill" feels screwed and the guy spamming shots thinks he's playing the game correctly, tries the same thing again and gets pissed off that it doesn't always work. Ultimately, nobody is happy.
People intuitively understand that full auto weapons have accuracy penalties for laying on the trigger. Always have, always will. The debate centers around the precision weapons.
I don't have strong feelings one way or the other, I just think it's an interesting discussion.
In short people think precision weapons and think they'll be precise each and every shot then then rage because they're not.
feel like i should pull this bit out of my previous post. of course bullet magnetism and auto aim gets pulled into it too, but the guy shooting slow also has thatQuote:
Originally Posted by Donut
Sorry, didn't read that part of your post. Apologies for restating almost exactly what you already said. I agree that it's questionable how valid a complaint it really is.
This is my complaint with the DMR/NR. The DMR's retarded range prevents open maps from having any sort of flow, while its spammability up close makes it not only obnoxious but less skilled to use compared to previous mid-range weapons in the series. Note that 'spam' doesn't have to mean firing as fast as possible. Just firing slightly faster than normal is enough to make it annoying. A lot of Reach proponents claim to hate the BR from Halo 3. Imagine how much more obnoxious it would be with unlimited range and the ability to fire FASTER at close range.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooky
Except no, not really, no. Rate of fire didn't affect the accuracy of precision weapons in previous games. Which is a huge difference. It might be a feature in the game's engine, but not in the actual gameplay.Quote:
Originally Posted by p0lar_bear
How's the DMR any different from any FPS that uses the Counter Strike style spread system is what I don't understand. It's even worse in those games because the spread is so much more intense and random than the DMR ever would be
Get their shields down with spam, pace the headshot. Works pretty much every time in 1 on 1s. Bumper jumper also helps. At the end of the day the more consistent person will be on top.
it did in halo 1 with the pistol if you held down click, but there was literally no negative effect to just releasing click between shots, so the weapon's accuracy didnt seem to be affected while firing at full speed. i gather the spread was an intended game element though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arteen
Maybe originally, but since they didn't keep that effect in Halo 2 or 3 I think that idea was pretty well trashed.
The issue I have with bloom is that it makes the DMR and the pistol needlessly awkward and uncomfortable to use. Not only does the pistol already have an absurdly small clip size and awful range, but it gets grossly inaccurate after only shot, so you always have to fire below its maximum rate of fire for it to be effective at any range beyond point-blank. It makes the weapon unsatisfying and uncomfortable to use, and this is coming from someone with two pistol kills for each pistol death.
The DMR has the same issue to a lesser extent, but I've got no problem with the bloom on the needle rifle.
Why would something which works for Counter Strike automatically work for Halo? As stated it's awkward, obnoxious, and plain unnecessary.Quote:
Originally Posted by t3h m00kz
>awkward, obnoxious, unecessary
opinions, and I disagree.
Whatever though. Guess we all have the right to disagree here.
Guess we'll see how the community reacts when everyone's getting instant head shots all the time spamming the shit out of the trigger when no bloom comes into play. And when the pistol comes back and everyone's dying from some guy camping on top of the map. Going to predict nobody's going to bitch any less, considering it's not going to be like Halo 1 LAN where everybody's playing to have a good time and not be assholes, or PC where you've got twelve year olds knocking warthogs around with plasma grenades and roleplaying McDonalds in Chronopolis.