Graphics Issue?

[Hydrog]

I give up, time to go back to h2 on the 360.

I went out and bought a nvidia 7100gs, the $64.99 price tag made me wet over the 7800 @ $134.99.

Same thing...

So to Mr. benfinkel aka the jewish know-it-all. It's not you my friend, i'm a cheeze dick... software devs are the biggest hardware nubs.

[Benfinkel]

Buckshot,

Whether or not the high-end of a previous generation will beat the low-end of the new generation is on a completely case-by-case basis. Take the highest end of Hyperthreaded Pentium CPUs versus the lowest end Core 2 CPUs. There are plenty of situations where the low end Core 2 will beat the high end Pentium. When the DX8 cards came out a low-end DX8 card would beat a high-end DX7 card almost every time. There isn't some phsyical law on generations that states they have to act in the manner you're describing.

And even if you buy all of that it's all predicated on the consumer knowing that the X700 and X1550 are of different "generations". They could easily be of the same generation with an entire array of X900s, X1000s, and X1200s in between, each gradually more powerful as the numbers seem to indicate. Somehow, you'd have to magically know that the 1 in X1550 was part of the X and not the 550. A google search for "Radeon X1 series" returns 1,710 results, none of which appear to point towards ATI's website, so I'm not even convinced there is an "X1 Generation".

For the average consumer, I don't see how this makes any sense. I'm fairly knowledgeable about this stuff and I still found it pretty confusing. The specas are about the only thing you've got. The X1550 is a higher clock speed GPU with faster RAM on a faster bus and more of it. Not to mention it was manufactured a couple of years after the release of the X600 so why should it only be slightly more powerful?

[Hydrog]

Holy shit, he does know it all!

42 finkel, forty...two.

[Benfinkel]

Well geez this Buckshot asshat makes it sound as if once you understand these mystical "generations" it all makes sense once again.

And if the 7100 gave you the same problems it sounds like there is something else going on in the menus and stuff. Did you ever get an accurate FPS count in-game?

[Xetsuei]

Buckshot,

Whether or not the high-end of a previous generation will beat the low-end of the new generation is on a completely case-by-case basis. Take the highest end of Hyperthreaded Pentium CPUs versus the lowest end Core 2 CPUs. There are plenty of situations where the low end Core 2 will beat the high end Pentium. When the DX8 cards came out a low-end DX8 card would beat a high-end DX7 card almost every time. There isn't some phsyical law on generations that states they have to act in the manner you're describing.

And even if you buy all of that it's all predicated on the consumer knowing that the X700 and X1550 are of different "generations". They could easily be of the same generation with an entire array of X900s, X1000s, and X1200s in between, each gradually more powerful as the numbers seem to indicate. Somehow, you'd have to magically know that the 1 in X1550 was part of the X and not the 550. A google search for "Radeon X1 series" returns 1,710 results, none of which appear to point towards ATI's website, so I'm not even convinced there is an "X1 Generation".

For the average consumer, I don't see how this makes any sense. I'm fairly knowledgeable about this stuff and I still found it pretty confusing. The specas are about the only thing you've got. The X1550 is a higher clock speed GPU with faster RAM on a faster bus and more of it. Not to mention it was manufactured a couple of years after the release of the X600 so why should it only be slightly more powerful?

Uh, if you go on newegg in the graphics card section, click on GPU and then it gives you a list. Two of those options are Radeon X Series and Radeon X1K Series. Hmmm.... Also, just because the ram and core speeds are faster doesnt mean its better/more powerful. Lets take a look at the GeForce 8600GTS and the 8800GTX. The core for 8600GTS is 675mhz and the memory is 1ghz. With the 8800GTX the core is 575mhz and the memory is 900mhz. Does that mean that the 8600GTS is better than the 8800GTX? Hell no!

[Mr Buckshot]

Buckshot,

Whether or not the high-end of a previous generation will beat the low-end of the new generation is on a completely case-by-case basis. Take the highest end of Hyperthreaded Pentium CPUs versus the lowest end Core 2 CPUs. There are plenty of situations where the low end Core 2 will beat the high end Pentium. When the DX8 cards came out a low-end DX8 card would beat a high-end DX7 card almost every time. There isn't some phsyical law on generations that states they have to act in the manner you're describing.

And even if you buy all of that it's all predicated on the consumer knowing that the X700 and X1550 are of different "generations". They could easily be of the same generation with an entire array of X900s, X1000s, and X1200s in between, each gradually more powerful as the numbers seem to indicate. Somehow, you'd have to magically know that the 1 in X1550 was part of the X and not the 550. A google search for "Radeon X1 series" returns 1,710 results, none of which appear to point towards ATI's website, so I'm not even convinced there is an "X1 Generation".

For the average consumer, I don't see how this makes any sense. I'm fairly knowledgeable about this stuff and I still found it pretty confusing. The specas are about the only thing you've got. The X1550 is a higher clock speed GPU with faster RAM on a faster bus and more of it. Not to mention it was manufactured a couple of years after the release of the X600 so why should it only be slightly more powerful?

I'm aware that my "generation" theory does not apply to CPUs - I was talking about modern video cards.

However, in the case of a DirectX transition, the matters change.

[Hydrog]

So let's say i go buy an 8800GT and experience the same issues... what else could possibly cause this slowdown?

I have vista tuned for gaming/performance, not a single app or service is running that doesn't need to be.

[Benfinkel]

Also, just because the ram and core speeds are faster doesnt mean its better/more powerful. Lets take a look at the GeForce 8600GTS and the 8800GTX. The core for 8600GTS is 675mhz and the memory is 1ghz. With the 8800GTX the core is 575mhz and the memory is 900mhz. Does that mean that the 8600GTS is better than the 8800GTX? Hell no!

So,

X700 > X1550 while X8600 < X8800. Core clock speeds don't matter, neither do amounts of RAM, ram bus speed or pixel pipes except of course when they do matter. A DX transition does matter, but the age of the engine of the game does not, in this case, come into play. There are some "series" changes in there, but you wouldn't know from the manufacturer, just from one online retailer.

On what criteria, besides running the game in question with various cards, can you make an educated guess at how well a card will run it?

[Xetsuei]

So,

X700 > X1550 while X8600 < X8800. Core clock speeds don't matter, neither do amounts of RAM, ram bus speed or pixel pipes except of course when they do matter. A DX transition does matter, but the age of the engine of the game does not, in this case, come into play. There are some "series" changes in there, but you wouldn't know from the manufacturer, just from one online retailer.

On what criteria, besides running the game in question with various cards, can you make an educated guess at how well a card will run it?

You don't quite seem to understand. You were the one going all of on how the X1550 has faster ram and core speeds than the X700, so it must be better. You also don't seem to get what buckshot is saying, that a mid range card in one generation will beat a low end card in the next generation. Also, it's not X8600 or X8800, its 8600GTS and 8800GTX. ATi and nVidia are different.

[Amit]

OK do yourself a favour and get a good graphics card so you won't have more problems. This game demands more than it should but we can't change that. Running out and buying a 7100GS does not mean it will work better than that crap geforce 6150 in your motherboard. You need to buy at least a geforce 7600GS to play this game with some decent framerates.